Re: X.10 for lighting - still limited???

[Keith Doxey <keith.doxey@xxxxxxx>]

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the info.
For anyone else who is interested in this, the cost of the
NJD MP820 is 159UKP + Vat. which works out to be just less
than 24UKP per channel. I am now going to do a bit more thinking
along these lines

Keith

Keith Doxey
http://www.btinternet.com/~krazy.keith
Krazy Keith's World of DIY Home Automation

-----Original Message-----
From:	Harrison, Mark (Alliance) [SMTP:Mark.Harrison@xxxxxxx]
Sent:	20 October 1998 12:51
To:	ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject:	[ukha_d] Re: X.10 for lighting - still limited???

Keith,

In some ways, I'm reassured to hear your view - here's some more
information
for you on the NJD solution we implemented:

The boxes we are using are the "NJD MP820"s.

They have a MIDI in (standard 5-pin din MIDI cable) and two Bulgin P552
sockets out, carrying 4 power lines each. (I seem to remember that you have
to buy the Bulgin plugs separately.)

The power handling is 5A per channel = 1.15kVa @ 230V AC with a limit of
20Amps per box overall, as you say 1000 watts per channel beats X.10 hands
down.

Control is through the MIDI in - you set a MIDI channel, and a range of
Notes by internal switches - each lighting channel responds to a different
note, and you turn a light on by sending a "MIDI ON" message to
the right
channel and note, with the attack volume corresponding (1-255) to the
desired lighting level. As with a MIDI sound device, you turn a light off
by
sending a "MIDI ON" message with attack volume of 0.

You may be amused to know that as a result of this, an old MIDI keyboard
becomes a useful tool for debugging the electrical installation ;-)

In principle, you can control fade times using MIDI CONTROL CHANGE commands
- At the moment we only have ON-Level / OFF functionality implemented in
the
software.

If you need more than 8 channels, you need to buy more NJD boxes
(obviously), but will also need to get a "MIDI distribution
amplifier."
Something like the Phillip Reese V8 or V10 (8 and 10 MIDI channels thus 64
or 80 lighting channels resptectively) which Turnkey sell for ?35.95+VAT
and
?39.95+VAT. With the power handling on the NJDs, these are
"independant
lighting channels" rather than "lights", so this could be 4
lights/channel
giving 240 lights - hopefully enough for most domestic installations! (Not
sure on my spelling of that product, Turnkey are on 0171 419 9999.)

The software we're using to hold it all together is P. Scargil's
"APPCON"
(CIX users can find him on the CIX homeautomation conference.) The software
doesn't support MIDI devices, but he gave one of the partners a copy of the
Visual Basic source code, so we had to add a shareware MIDI library.

Given we were completely rewiring, we put in "normal switches"
but then
wired them back to a central patch panel separately from the lighting
wiring. This meant that we could patch them through to lights bypassing the
Home Automation stuff completely if required, or patch them through to the
serial switch handler on the Appcon control ring. I lose track at this
point, because I don't understand the Appcon stuff in detail - the MIDI
interfacing and the electrical wiring I could handle, the Appcon stuff is
dealt with by one of my partners. (There are three of us.)

We felt it was important to be able to cut the "home automation"
out of the
loop completely if required (either cos it all failed, or to allow the
house
to be sold on to a neanderthal if later required.) The patch-panel approach
gives us this flexibility. (Accurate labelling of cabling runs is
critical.)

Mark Harrison
European IT Manager
BP/Bovis Alliance
Tel: +44 181 869 1439
Fax: +44 181 423 7711
VT: +44 181 423 7349
SMTP: Mark.Harrison@xxxxxxx

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Keith Doxey [SMTP:keith.doxey@xxxxxxx]
> Sent:	Tuesday, October 20, 1998 12:03 PM
> To:	'ukha_d@xxxxxxx'
> Subject:	[ukha_d] Re: X.10 for lighting - still limited???
>
> Tell me more about the Midi solution.
> I though about using NJD's Midi Packs when I went to PLASA 97 at
> Earls Court but never took the idea any further as NJD didnt send me
the
> technical spec I asked for and I forgot about it due to too many other
> projects
> on the go.
>
> It occurred to me at the time that everyone who was using a PC as the
> basis of a Home Automation system would already have the Midi
interface
> on their soundcards. What I needed to know from NJD was how much
> control you have over the 8 channels.
>
> I disagree with your comments regarding X-10 being available "Off
the
> Shelf"
> so far the only readily available kit for the UK are Lamp/Appliance
> modules
> and the CM12U plus a couple of mini controllers. The most wanted and
> needed
> items, namely the Wall Switches are STILL not available  :-((
>
> The NJD midi packs on the other hand are readily available, made in
the UK
> and most likely more cost effective per channel controlled, and at
1000
> watts
> per channel easily beat any X-10 dimmer for power handling.
>
> Any further info you have on your software and design would be very
> interesting.
>
> Regards
>
> Keith
>
> Keith Doxey
> http://www.btinternet.com/~krazy.keith
> Krazy Keith's World of DIY Home Automation
>
>
> Any X.10 gurus out there???
>
> The last time I looked at X.10 for lighting it was fairly limited in
terms
> of its dimming capabilities. In particular, you couldn't go from zero
to
> an
> arbitrary setting (say 70%). Instead, you had to go all the way on,
and
> then
> dim back to the required state.
>
> This proved to be unnaceptable for a current client (who is himself a
> lighting-designer), because he needed to be able to go straight to set
dim
> levels at night.
>
> We went for a whole set of NJD MIDI lighting controllers, which not
only
> can
> be given fancy fade effects through a cheap PC/soundcard combo, but
will
> also take the kind of high-impedance loads that in-line halogen
dimmers
> present. It actually worked surprisingly well, considering that we
thought
> we might have to end up using DMX kit which is rather more expensive.
Of
> course, there was a significant amount of programming work involved in
> interfacing the (MIDI) lighting control back to the HA software.
>
> Clearly, doing everything through X.10 would cut down tremendously on
the
> workload, and allow us to use a lot more off-the-shelf components...
>
> Does anyone have experience/views on this? HA Consultancy isn't my
> full-time
> job (yet).
>
>
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