Re: Can anyone get the connected home right?

[Chris Hunter <cjhunter@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Phil -

brilliant, many thanks ... have to say, I am coming around to the=20=20
idea of such a system ... previously, it seemed to me there was=20=20
nothing wrong with DVDs in a book-case & a home-cinema ... now I=20=20
understand what you're after & we're aiming for something much
more=20=20
multi-media & multi-screen & about the house ... not least because
we=20=20
seldom can agree on what to watch, and having a separate room for=20=20
watching seems less & less appropriate ...

'quite like the fast reader for DVDs that Kaliedescape seem to=20=20
include ...

Chris


On 21 Jul 2007, at 14:39, Phil Harris wrote:

> Then yes, that'd be me.
>
> I had a play with a Kaliedescape a few years ago (so with standard def
> material) and it was bloody nice, the kit was beautifully
assembled=20=20
> and
> presented and as far as I can tell the UI seemed bug free and=20=20
> reasonably
> easy to use without being "pre-trained" but then again for
the=20=20
> money I'd
> expect it to be! (The servers and DVD drives looked great but they're
> intended to be hidden in racks so that's a bit of a waste IMO.)=20=20
> Only thing I
> didn't like at the time was that they had separate=20=20
> "analogue" (composite,
> s-video and component video) and "digital" (DVI) players -
they now=20=20
> have a
> player that covers all bases with composite, s-video, component
and=20=20
> HDMI
> outputs.
>
> I priced up a Kaleidescape for someone at the time though and it=20=20
> was just
> scary ... for a handful of room players, about 600 DVDs worth of=20=20
> storage and
> a single network attached DVD drive (for ripping) I think it
came=20=20
> to about
> =A348k. I'd expect the storage costs per DVD to have come down a fair
=
=20
> bit (I
> know that the maximum capacity per server has certainly
increased=20=20
> hugely)
> but the kit is never going to be cheap. However as an "object
of=20=20
> desire"
> then it probably shouldn't ever be cheap enough for everyone to
be=20=20
> able to
> afford it. No matter how much I'd like a setup here I'm not
going=20=20
> to launch
> into a tirade of "It's far too expensive and they should sell
it=20=20
> cheaper as
> they'd sell more." I see that they've now integrated the DVD
drive=20=20
> into the
> latest player which apart from saving a fortune on a rather=20=20
> stupidly (IMO)
> thought through system whereby the ripping unit was a separate=20=20
> device also
> means that they're now legally able to produce their players
(the=20=20
> licensing
> of DVD players *WITHOUT* a DVD drive in them has always been=20=20
> something that
> has plagued manufacturers and sticking in a local DVD drive gets=20=20
> round all
> that).
>
> I'm still looking for that "ideal player" ... gone through
loads of
> possibilities over the last few years and it would be really
nice=20=20
> if it were
> possible to use something like an AppleTV for that purpose as it
is=20=20
> a nice
> looking bit of kit at a reasonable price and hardware-wise it
ticks=20=20
> the
> boxes (for video and audio outputs, no external PSU, nice and
quiet=20=20
> running
> etc.).
>
> Seeing that they've got OSX running on it now then it might be getting
> towards being more of an option if only I was any good at writing
a=20=20
> UI ...
> currently I have a really ropey looking front end that I wrote in
a=20=20
> hurry in
> Dark BASIC which simply goes and looks at two network shares -
the=20=20
> first
> being the network share containing all my DVDs and the second
being=20=20
> the
> Recorded Programs share of my MCE machine - it then reads the=20=20
> contents of
> those folders (i.e. the files in them), does a little bit of=20=20
> manipulation of
> the names of the files from the MCE machine to make them
readable=20=20
> (i.e.
> extracts the name, source channel and recording date / time)=20=20
> produces two
> scrollable lists - one of movie names and one of recorded TV=20=20
> program names
> that you can just flip through. Selecting an entry just spawns off
> Zoomplayer or TheaterTek and when they've finished doing their
bit=20=20
> then it
> just returns back to my program.
>
> It looks crude as hell because it *IS* as crude as hell but it=20=20
> works, it
> doesn't crash and it doesn't at any point make any references to=20=20
> any network
> locations or file names within the "user interface" (I use
the term=20=20
> "user
> interface" very loosely at this time) - I keep telling myself
that=20=20
> if/when I
> get some spare time I'll extend it to include some funky smooth=20=20
> scrolling
> within the lists (which I like to think would look as slick as
the=20=20
> scrolling
> within MCE but I know won't do as I won't have the patience) and=20=20
> also some
> better searching and linking facilities (at the moment I can
filter=20=20
> the list
> of DVD movies by a substring but again it's crude and clunky
rather=20=20
> than
> being slick and I'd like to incorporate cover art and actor=20=20
> searching /
> linking).
>
> I don't like devices that try to be all things to all men and
then=20=20
> fail to
> be properly useable in any of them (the old "Jack of all trades
and=20=20
> master
> of none" principle) - or worse prove unreliable and either hang
or=20=20
> crash!
> ... (TiVo was a superb example of a really nicely focussed
product=20=20
> that was
> simply superb in how it delivered its core functionality without being
> loaded down with unnecessary fluff and/or fripperies.) I have a=20=20
> laptop and
> PCs if I want to browse the internet so I don't want that being
an=20=20
> option on
> my TV, I have my SliMP3s if I want to play music (and they don't=20=20
> need the
> telly turned on to be able to interact with), I have handy
remotes=20=20
> if I want
> to be able to turn things on and off so why do I want a home=20=20
> automation GUI
> on my TV screen? Be realistic about what you want devices to do=20=20
> (and what
> they really should do) and don't just implement functionality=20=20
> because it can
> be done rather than because it's a really useful function.
>
> I guess this is a roundabout way of explaining *WHY* I liked the
> Kaliedescape when I had a play ... it wasn't because it was
feature=20=20
> rich, it
> wasn't because it was loaded down with moronic functionality
that=20=20
> was bolted
> in just because the hardware could do it and the software author=20=20
> thought it
> would be a good idea. It just "worked" in the way that a
normal DVD=20=20
> player
> "works" because you stick a DVD in and it starts to play -
there's the
> minimum of confusing fluff between you and what you want to do!
>
> Of course if you can't afford to by the kit that does the job
"right"
> there's not that many options for you to take but generally they=20=20
> boil down
> to a combination of the following:
>
> 1) Forget about doing it. (Doesn't really apply with the crowd
on=20=20
> here.)
>
> 2) Whine about how much the proper kit is and how the
manufacturers=20=20
> should
> modify their sales model to get it right. (Which strangely
always=20=20
> seems to
> manage to include the person grumbling about the current price
into=20=20
> their
> target market).
>
> 3) Wait for someone else to "home brew" a solution and
accept the
> compromises in UI and functionality that they impose on their=20=20
> solution that
> don't fit in with what you want.
>
> 4) Home brew your own solution which takes time and you have to=20=20
> wait for
> other people or companies to provide the product(s) that plug
the=20=20
> gaps in
> the solution that you can't fill from your own abilities.
>
> 5) Go work for a company that produces (or may produce) a
solution=20=20
> to do
> what you want to achieve, if you're lucky. ;-)
>
> Phil
>
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